Dept. of Classic Who

[kaffyr]

So. The Seventh

After developing rather a large love for the Seventh Doctor through loads of really good fanfic and nothing else, BB and I finally sat down tonight to start watching his adventures. First up: Time and The Rani.

Well. That was dismal.

Not the Doctor - it was just his first adventure and he came in on a truly execrable plot, written horribly, directed badly .... and oh, dear lord, the music. I've got to say, anyone making snide remarks about Murray Gold really needs to listen to whoever wrote the incidental music for this one.

Nor was it Bonnie Langford. She seemed far less annoying than I've been led to believe. But my goodness, the woman who played the Rani. Great costume, mind you. But ...maybe she was ambushed by the writing and directing. Yes, let's leave it at that.

"Paradise Towers," on the other hand, was cheesy and camp - but deliberately so. I liked it a hell of a lot better than Seven's first adventure.

Comments

[st_aurafina]

Seven's run starts off in full clown mode, but push on. The darkness at the end of his run makes the clownishness really, really scary in hindsight. Push on till Ace shows up - the whole thing pivots on Dragonfire.

My favourite Doctor, this one.

[kaffyr]

And I can see right from the beginning that Seven was very serious when he needed to be. His clownlike aspects, even in the first adventure, were far less obvious than I'd been lead to believe. Perhaps it's something in his eyes. Anyhow, I believe I like him a reat deal, despite the godawful introduction.

[thisbluespirit]

:lol: Sorry, but Time and the Rani is... not good. It can be enjoyably cracky when you're in the mood for nonsense and Kate O'Mara doing a Bonnie Langford impression, but... yes.

Don't worry - that's the worst of Seven over and done with right there. Everything else may vary, but it's pretty great, mostly. (And Delta next! Some people hate it, but it's got dancing and bee-keepers and holiday camps. Terrible, terrible music, but Ray and Goronwy and Mr Burton, and Seven beginning to find himself. ♥)

:-)

ETA: But then I love Seven a lot. You may have noticed.

[kaffyr]

I understand a lot of people don't like Delta and the Bannermen, but perhaps just because of that, I want to see it a great deal. And it's good to know that Time and the Rani may be the low point. Heh.

[clocketpatch]

Listen, I looovvee Seven but Time and the Rani is... best forgotten really. There's just bad plot, bad acting, bad sfx, that awful Seven-in-a-wig moment... yeah. It is not to be taken for what the rest of Seven is like.

I really like Paradise Towers, personally, despite it being utterly ridiculous. It's an aware sort of ridiculous and watching Mel determinedly try to swim in the death pool makes me giggle more than it should.

But the thing about Seven is that he changes completely once Ace shows up, and that's when things get interesting and you start wondering if this dark, chess playing, guardian of time is the real Seven and the clown was only a mask, or if the clown is the real him and the darker personae is just what he's being forced to become... (Also, Ace is the most awesome part, keep watching for Ace! She's great in fic, but nothing really compares to the real deal.)

[eve11.livejournal.com]

popping in to say, I love your icon :)

I know Seven mainly from the audios. Took me a bit to warm to him (he does have kind of a ridiculous voice when you're not used to it!), but now I do really like him a lot.

[kaffyr]

It's a very rich voice, isn't it?

[kaffyr]

You're not the first person to give a sad thumbs-down on Time and the Rani. And Paradise Towers is all sorts of sociological camp fun. Mel's outfit is fully as ridiculous as any of the Kangs, and the two creepy old ladies are delightfully creepy.

I'm already seeing darkness in Seven. He's got very serious eyes, even now.

[cygnia.livejournal.com]

Have you ever listened to any of the Big Finish audios? There are some really good Seven stories there...

[kaffyr]

No, I've listened to none of them, although I've heard good things about them. I guess it's time to go nosing about ... any recommendations?

[cygnia.livejournal.com]

"Colditz" is supposed to be really good. And there's a familiar voice playing one of the villains... :)

"Fires of Vulcan" & "The Fearmonger" come highly recommended to me as well.

[kaffyr]

OOOOooooo - thank you for the recommendations!

[ladymercury-10.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen either of those, but I love Seven and Ace in "Remembrance of the Daleks."

[kaffyr]

I'm told that once Ace shows up, things perk up in quality - I'm willing to wait for this adventure.

[britgeekgrrl.livejournal.com]

Seven's tenure on telly takes a lot of work to love, imho. It was Big Finish that really saved the sixth, seventh AND eighth Doctors for me.

That said, I have a soft spot for The Curse of Fenric and Paradise Towers, but that's about all...

[kaffyr]

Heh ... another vote for Paradise Towers! And you're the second person to say that I should listen to the Big Finish stories. Must hunt those down; thanks!

[britgeekgrrl.livejournal.com]

If you're conscience is more, um, robust than mine, you can find 'em shared here and there, quite easily.

Big Finish often does specials on the older titles, too - and now they FINALLY offer a download model (it was far too long in coming) rather than having to pay to import a CD from Blighty.

But *do* take the time to read some reviews as, like anything, some stories are great and some are clangers. But I'd say about 80% of them fab, which is pretty darn good. ;)

[kaffyr]

My conscience is, perhaps, more flexible than yours, and I salute you. I am indeed shameless, and I shall go hunting for them. But I have a little left on my gift card, and perhaps I can actually be virtuous and pay for some of the Big Finish ones. Definitely will read reviews; cygnia has started me off with a couple.

[livii.livejournal.com]

Aw, I really liked Time and the Rani. You just have to have no expectations. ;) It was silly and fun, and I love Kate O'Mara as the Rani, and especially when she was pretending to be Mel, haha! Of course, I looked at my tags and I watched this in '07, so also time is on my side here in terms of remembering. But honestly there is very little classic Who I don't like, so. In fact, while I like Seven's run (seen it all but Survival), I thought it got unnecessarily weird and dark at the end, and his early episodes with Mel are more fun, and more enjoyable.

[kaffyr]

That's a great icon! When it comes to the darkness, since I tend to be of dour Canadian Scots-Dutch stock, I often revel in it (which is probably why I love Nine and Eleven), so I may be in a win-win situation with Seven. I like him now, and I may also like him once the going gets a little more grey.

[jjpor.livejournal.com]

The good thing, though, is that that's the worst of Seven past you, right out of the gate. I'm glad you liked Paradise Towers - it is ridiculous and camp, true, but it's easily as good as the best of TV-Six and better than about fifty percent of Five stories - and both Delta and the Bannermen (which might be the best of S24) and Dragonfire are even stronger. And then...

Then comes S25 and S26. Stick with Seven, even through the odd not-as-good story (I think both S25 and S26 have one that's clearly the least-good out of the season, but which one is probably down to what you as a Who fan value most in a story); he will not disappoint you. This is something I feel passionately about - contesting the receive wisdom in a lot of quarters that old-Who declined and fell during the 80s. It certainly did decline, and indeed did fall in the end, but just before the end it had its last great hoorah, and the characters of Seven and Ace and the chances the writers were allowed to take are what makes it.

Why yes, I am a biased Seven fan. However did you guess? ;)

[kaffyr]

Everything you say makes me even more excited about continuing my Seven watch, and frankly, it's been commentary and comments by Seven fans like yourself who got me interested in that incarnation in the first place. I think some of your fics based around and after Battlefield were the ones that sparked it, actually!

[jessalrynn.livejournal.com]

Delta and the Bannermen is my favorite. Let me know what you think! *laughs*

[kaffyr]

Heh - I just watched Delta and the Bannermen two nights ago. I loved it (with the exception of poor Murray and the bus tourists, which I thought was quite unnecessary), partly because there's this wonderful childlike acceptance on everyone's part about the Doctor and Mel. And then I saw Dragonfire, and was introduced to Ace, and things are looking even more promising.